FORESIGHT: What happened in the 19th and 20th century? Creating a doomed future.

in #philosophy7 years ago (edited)

The editing of history bothers me a great deal. I am one of those that considers the burning of the Library of Alexandria as one of the worst catastrophes in human history. We have fragments of knowledge that escaped that and some of those fragments such as the few surviving works of Plato (when there were said to be many more) are works that still influence us to this day. How much of early history was stored there and documented and is lost? Could there have been historical documents and records that explain places like Gobekli Tepe and other amazing archaeological findings? Could there have been an explanation of how the antikythera mechanism could have existed at the time it apparently existed, and how did it end up on the bottom of the ocean? It is possible these answers were in the library of Alexandria and were lost. We will never know unless we invent time travel.

I have heard accounts of temples in Egypt and other parts of the world where a statue may be destroyed, a face intentionally removed, or certain glyphs on rocks having been scraped away in an attempt to erase that person from history. This leaves those of us that come later speculating and trying to solve these mysteries. I get angry thinking of the ignorance and ARROGANCE of humans and how we believe we should obliterate things from the past we don't like. Let us make certain that no one ever knows of this thing, or talks about it again.

There is that saying "Those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat it" yet it seems that when people seek to erase the history they don't like that they are making that doom more likely to come in the future. People that might have had an opportunity to learn from it do not even have that opportunity, because it is obscured.

Recently we have had ISIS bulldozing and destroying ancient temples from Mesopotamia, Babylon, and our ancient history. In their ignorance and arrogance they wish to wipe out the past when people believed differently than them. What does this leave? It leaves a void in the historical record.


This infuriates me when I see this idiocy and rampant marriage of ignorance and arrogance destroying the past. It cannot be recovered. Once it is done, it is gone. There are no take backs from these morons. I don't usually use such terms, but I consider it very fitting in this particular type of situation. I do not consider it an ad hominem attack here. It is a statement of fact as far as I am concerned.

It is actually worse than this. People may understand this and get outraged if they are not part of ISIS or ISIS sympathizers. They may say how bad this is. They may even agree with me on Alexandria, and all the past defacing and erasing of history.

Then we mention the Confederate Flag, statues of confederate generals such as Robert E. Lee, or other prominent members of the American past that they don't like. Suddenly, they are fine with destroying them, erasing them from history, banning any representation of them, etc. What they don't see is the pure hypocrisy in this. This is NO different from what ISIS and all of the other marriages of ignorance and arrogance have been doing in our history. It is erasing and editing history. ISIS is erasing memories from the past they don't like. Those banning the Confederate flag are doing the same thing with the same justification. It is not like the confederate flag suddenly makes someone a slave owner, or that a piece of cloth with colors on it forces someone to take an act. They don't have that kind of power or ability.

Video documenting racist past of the flag - still not a reason to ban anything.

I see this as an advancement of the SAFE SPACES doctrine which I personally find to be ludicrous and pure stupidity. It is attempting to remake reality into a fantasy ideal world. Let's pretend these things didn't exist, and didn't happen. Then it advances, let's wipe any trace of the fact it happened.

In the future maybe we will have none of these past lessons and figures from the past upon which to talk about lessons. Robert E. Lee? "Grandma, why are you angry about Robert E. Lee? I've never heard of him." Then grandma dies.


[Source: Wikipedia] - Ban my post, because I posted this image. Same concept, same ignorance and arrogant ideology.

The good or the bad lessons that might go with history are lost. Future generations are doomed to repeat things that we should have learned from the past. Why? The masses just had to have their safe spaces. They just had to virtue signal and show how GREAT they were because they destroyed some monument, or record of someone that did what they perceive as bad things sometime in the past. It offends them. Reality offends them. They should not have to EVER be offended or face things in reality that they find offensive. Just wait until what you do, say, or think offends them. We are allowing precedence to be set that it is okay to censor reality as long as someone with sufficient authority agrees that it is offensive.

Setting precedence is a slippery slope. You may be all excited and endorsing the erasing of history you don't like now. In doing so you are providing support for a mental/censoring/manipulative/fakehistory weapon that can be turned just as easily against things and ideas you like in the future. This power to censor should NOT exist, regardless of how offensive you find something. We learn from being exposed to offensive things just as much as we learn from non-offensive things. In fact, I'd even argue we might actually learn more from the offensive things.

That doesn't mean we need to FORCE the rest of the world to never expose us to offensive things.

Now to circle around. The Unite the Right Rally was not just white supremacists, it was not just racists. There were definitely some of that sort in that group. Yet, a lot of the people there were simply there to protest the recent demands to remove the statue of General Robert E. Lee. They didn't want history edited. This didn't mean they were confederates. It did not mean they were racists. It simply means they believe the history should remain available for all to study. It simply means that your right to put crosses on things, and put symbols and people you like on shirts is protected, and so should the right of other people to do the same.

The statue, the racism, Trump, mainstream media, etc did not cause the violence. That is looking for a scapegoat. That is people not taking responsibility for their own choices. That is blaming people rather than accepting guilt. When it comes to violence ultimately the choice to go that route is up to the individual. Can other sources influence them? Yes, most definitely. Yet what choice they make is not ultimately the fault of those influences. We are individuals and we must be responsible for our own choices, and the consequences of those choices.

That is another side effect of the safe space, virtue signalling, backwards world we are increasingly creating. We have an increasing number of people that seem unwilling or unable to take responsibility for the consequences of their own choice. It is the fault of anyone else but themselves.

This has to stop. If you make a choice. The consequences good or bad are YOUR responsibility and not someone else. If you don't believe this then that would logically indicate that you view yourself simply as a puppet and not an individual. Quit looking to blame people for choices you make. Own your mistakes, and your successes and LEARN from them.

Now I am going to be very blunt. If you can't handle profanity, please stop reading now.

Fuck Safe Spaces, Fuck Virtue Signalling, and Fuck anyone that wants to edit and erase history.

People need to grow the fuck up and face reality GOOD and BAD rather than trying to pretend it doesn't exist.

Could I have said that without using profanity? Yes. I didn't want to. Like I said Fuck Safe Spaces.

EDIT: One of several shares of this video. This one is from a Black Man named Anthony Brian Logan.
Trump Wrecks Fake News Reporters At Trump Tower Over Charlottesville Questions (REACTION)

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I totally agree, however there is the strange case of the Vatican's secret library. Why is it so secret? Perhaps it contains the co called "lost" history that we all know is out there. Some speculate that what was burned in Alexandria was all the admin records and all sacred texts were taken back to Rome....things that make you go hmmmm. Great article.

I am not a fan of secret libraries, or government secrets. They should be public as far as I am concerned. The fact something needs to be made secret immediately indicates it is likely dicey/shady in one way or the other.

Well said. I also find it jarring that some European countries have laws about what "history" you can question.

Reminds me of that Voltaire quote, which may be mis-attributed: "To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize."

I often wonder about what types of machinery might have been described in the books destroyed at the burning of the Library of Alexandria. One passage in the Old Testament refers to a man creating machinery for war, but it's not really expanded on.

Reminds me of that Voltaire quote, which may be mis-attributed: "To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize."

Nice this may be the first time I've heard that. Well said.

We have all sorts of evidence that has arisen showing maps of the coastlines of every continent including Antarctica well before they were said to be "discovered". We have evidence of Vikings, Phonecians, Egyptians, and others making it the the Americas way before Columbus supposedly "discovered" it. I often find myself wondering if how that is possible may have been in the documents at Alexandria.

So much was lost.

Yet the attitude that caused that loss still exists today. History should not be censored or edited, PERIOD.

@dwinblood We do have something in-between. I recently started a series on American history. I think the first one should be up your alley. It has a map which is now in the Library of Congress and a blow-up of a segment. If this does not put a smile on your face then come and get your money back.

Thanks. I read it, up voted it, and resteemed it... not all parts just your most recent, but keep it up. Good stuff, and useful information to be storing on the blockchain. Especially in this time where erasing history seems to be a thing that is in vogue.

"So much was lost" is right!

Myself, I am convinced that there is no curve, from experiments others have done which I have been able to repeat. I think the "Azimuthal Equidistant" map may be the right one. East-to-west circumnavigation works on that map, since the north pole is in the center, and thus as you're traveling east, you end up making minor course corrections the entire way so that you end up going in a circle, returning to where you started from.

Never in the course of history has anybody done a north-to-south circumnavigation -- and that's an important data point!

I believe they haven't made a north to south navigation primarily due to how dangerous the north and south poles are to most forms of travel. There are also not easy refueling locations for those.

I think that We must know our past to improve the present. Excellent post.

Yes, we must face the things from our past, distant, or close that we don't like or think were bad. We must learn from them. Erasing them is actually doing everyone a disservice.

I don't know of any art, statue, words, etc that take over my mind and suddenly turn me into a racist person who wants to own slaves. I also don't see any statues that make me suddenly decide to go and attack ISIS.

They are just things. They are input. What I decide to do with that input is up to me.

People destroying things and taking the choice away from myself and others to view that input is another type of input. It makes me very aware of those people that are forcing their world view upon me. It makes me think as I do with all history censors that the world would be a better place without them.

It really tests my belief in the NAP. If there has ever been a type of person I'd like to execute if it were not against my beliefs, then those who seek to obliterate and censor would be my first targets.

Most of the people who support the removal of the confederate history have no clue what it was actually about. It is much easier to scream about racism because it is something people can't defend. Who supports racism? Nobody with a brain. But unfortunately ignorant people can't get over the fact that the history of the southern U.S. represents a lot more than slavery. And I am not a southerner defending my home turf. I've lived my whole life in Pennsylvania. I simply paid attention in history class.

You know when I was a kid one of favorite TV show was the Dukes of Hazzard. Could you imagine if that show was created now? A hot rod with the confederate flag called the General Lee? What a shitstorm that would be.

And I am not a southerner defending my home turf. I've lived my whole life in Pennsylvania. I simply paid attention in history class.

I've lived in Colorado since I was 4. I am now 47. I get it. I am also extremely anti-racist. Yet I know you cannot fight racist, by being racist. I consider Black Lives Matter a racist organization. I happen to be a fan of Morgan Freeman's take on racism and agree with him completely.

And yeah, as a kid the Dukes of Hazzard was actually the only thing I ever thought of when I saw the confederate flag. :) People making a big deal about it made me dig into it further. Dukes of Hazzard wasn't promoting any racism that I remember.

I really respect Freeman for advancing that perspective. Wallace would have been pilloried if he had done the same. I would have liked to see Freeman and Ali debate the issue. Ali is overtly politically incorrect by today's standards but it is worth watching.

Yeah I've watched quite a bit of Ali. I like to imagine he might have changed his mind if he knew where things would end up today. Sadly, we are not prophets, just humans.

Thank you for posting this clip. If only people would listen to Morgan Freeman. He made me laugh out loud the way he schooled Wallace.

You notice how Wallace quickly fell back on 'Well I'm Jewish." That is a perfect example of what's wrong with people today. When Freeman challenged him about the need for a Black History Month, Wallace had no rationale, no counterpoint. He simply went to "I'm Jewish". What the hell does your religious beliefs have to do with this? Because you are jewish you understand the problems black Americans have faced? He just assumed Freeman was for Black History Month because Freeman is black. And Freeman caught him totally off guard by challenging the notion we need a separate month to celebrate black history.

We are all Americans. We are all in this together.

We are all Americans. We are all in this together.

We are all human. This is a global problem. Yes, you and I are Americans, but some of the people here are not and they too are having to deal with similar situations.

That is true. I should have said we are all human. We have to share this planet together.

Just wanted to respond to your "nobody with a brain," because I see it completely the opposite of how the MSM portrays it.

Biology and human nature dictates that people want to be around people who:

  1. Look like them;
  2. Behave like them;
  3. Think like them;
  4. Worship like them.

Why is there a Chinatown in Boston?

Why did my Jewish friend go to a Jewish-only camp every summer?

It's the Jewish-run media that's pushing the multi-cultural revolution. They do that in every country they invade. (Not saying my friend is a part of that, although he has uttered some "chosenite"-type phrases...) They also push pornography and division -- if we're divided amongst ourselves including the family, then we can't clearly focus on the invaders.

Totally agree with your attitude on safe spaces. I somehow fear it's more than some nut-jobs finding issues with a statue or a flag. MSM is right behind them and amplifies whatever stupid idea they come up with. Look how colleges accommodate every crazy demand. "You're upset Trump won, here's your safe space, have some crayons, have a cuddle". I've never heard of a college taking a hardline approach, like we don't care you're butt-hurt by Trump's win, your paper is still due tomorrow. All these young (mental) liberals are actively encouraged to demand more and more - no wonder they take their fantasies for real.
As for re-writing history - I grew up under a Communist regime and most of the history we learned in school was fake. Decades later many people still believe that fake history they learned in school...

As for re-writing history - I grew up under a Communist regime and most of the history we learned in school was fake. Decades later many people still believe that fake history they learned in school...

Have you done a post on that? If you have I'd like a link, if you haven't then you should and I still want a link. :)

No, I haven't. Thanks for suggesting it. Will send a link, promise!

We learn from history and past mistakes.If they are erased,then the children of the future are doomed to repeat them!

It bothers me too. Robert E. Lee is still widely regarded as a genius on the battlefield winning most of his battles against Northern armies that were far superior in size and guns.

His theories of war and tactics are still studied in war college for Generals of today. Unfortunately, the praise for these generals at the War College has been under attack for a long time. The last I remember, they were really struggling with pulling RObert E. Lee out.

What I learned from Robert E. Lee was his critical mistakes, just as you have indicated Deva. My analysis and understanding of the Civil Ware indicates that Lee was a superior General who was WINNING the war for the South...

They just ran out of ammo.

Hence Lee's big mistake that we can still learn from today. Lincoln's blockades worked, and the south ran out of ammo. This is the importance of logistics...

AND MAY THAT LESSON NEVER

EVER

Be forgotten.

Sherman is another one regularly studied from that time period. Germany's Rommel aka The Desert Fox in WW2 was known to have heavily studied Sherman.

Plus Robert E. Lee actually spoke against slavery, and freed some slaves. Not all confederates were in the war due to slavery.

I'm looking at things from what I believe to be a different angle. What if the destruction of things that people deem offensive to be a type of"Tabula Rasa" which is to the epistemological idea that individuals are born without built-in mental content and that therefore all knowledge comes from experience or perception. Aristotle writes about this in De anima (On the Soul), in the 4th century bce. If you erase/destroy all alternative experiences and ideas to what is not conguent to the official accepted narrative, you have a population of people who are willing to believe everything those in power show or tell them. It's in the Marxist hand book with Marx, Mao Tse Tung (and some would also argue Antifa) using this technique to bolster their followers.

If you want to go back even further in time, you can go back as far as the Egyptians who destroyed the name and likeness of anyone that they disagreed with from the statues and monuments. I don't see any difference with Egypt and what is happening in the US over the last little while.

If you erase/destroy all alternative experiences and ideas to what is not conguent to the official accepted narrative, you have a population of people who are willing to believe everything those in power show or tell them. It's in the Marxist hand book with Marx, Mao Tse Tung (and some would also argue Antifa) using this technique to bolster their followers.

Yes, I believe this is what is happening. I also see the SAFE SPACE movement as a new tool in this arsenal.

If you want to go back even further in time, you can go back as far as the Egyptians who destroyed the name and likeness of anyone that they disagreed with from the statues and monuments.

I'm pretty sure I made reference to that in my post.

So are you saying you advocate such behavior? I am unclear from your response.

Like you, the editing of history bothers me a great deal. I'm known to keep the original hard copies of books just in case they are altered and have rescued many tomes from the trash.

Trump has it right on this statement stuff. He wants the facts, the media does give a shit about the facts. Very good post very good video choice. How many people realize that the swastika is a symbol of love, peace, life, and tracker of this and that. there is so so many meanings of the swastika, yet the only meaning anyone places on it is the symbol of hate. lets re-write more history, maybe if the precious little snowflakes, and those oh so precious buttercups, may one day get the history re-written to the point it makes sense to them. (yeh when hell freezes over).

Actually, as I recall, the Nazi swastika was actually a mirror-reversed version of the original swastika which was some flavour of Asian (Tibetan, I think. Or was it Hindu) It was that original version that was a symbol of love, peace, life and etcete-fucking-ra.

Thus, therefore the NAZI SWASTIKA was and is in fact a symbol of hate.

EDIT: decided to do a little research rather than relying on memory as above. Turns out the Nazi verion is actually tilted 45 degrees. Thanks.

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You did that very well. Started with stuff any sensible person could agree with (ISIS destroying and defacing the past - like the Taliban before them ironically)
Then you equate it with Americans wanting to get rid of Confederate statues. You know, like those two things are equivalent.

They aren't.

Trust and believe, getting rid of those statues will in no way cause Americans to forget the atrocities their ancestors were subjected to by the institution of slavery. Destroying a statue of Robert E Lee or whichever slaver general will not cause him to be forgotten. He is not worshipped, he is not a tourist attraction, his statue is not the sole connection to him or his time. We have history books for that.

It has nothing to do with Safe Spaces and everything to do with not letting white supremacist lunatics be comfortable and inspired.

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