Major update to 100 Days of Poetry Challenge [Day 53]

d-pend (73) 7 years ago (edited)

Please leave your feedback to this update in a comment below as @prydefoltz, @mamadini, @trucklife-family, @tygertyger, @sansoncarrasco, @marlyncabrera, @zeleiracordero, @firststeps, @riahdex, @mrbreeziewrites, and @josediccus have already done. If you prefer to message me your feedback privately, do so on Discord. My username there is d-pend#5693.

This is not just my challenge, it's our challenge, and I highly value your perspective. I think people are focusing too much on the term critique. I'm looking for high quality feedback for other poets. That means reading their piece of your choice several times and setting aside a half hour or so to formulate a substantial reply.

If you choose to bow out of the challenge because of these new requirements, please let me know as soon as possible so I can update the assignments for the coming week.

$2.36

7 votes

acousticsteveo (61) 7 years ago

@d-pend it seems like most of the pushback is coming from people who either don't feel like they have the time to commit to this new change, or they feel uncomfortable about it because they want to connect with people naturally and organically. I actually understand both perspectives. You know I don't have a lot of time either, and I really think the only reason why I've done as much as I've done in this challenge is because it's an extreme passion of mine, and I get a lot of enjoyment out of it on a personal level. I think maybe you should consider allowing some of those who are in opposition to the changes to work the challenge as they deem fit. I've looked over who has brought up these concerns, and they are all people who are contributing to this challenge in numerous ways. If they want an exception maybe they should be granted it. I think there will be enough people that want to stay in according to your changes that we can go ahead and do it with those people, and just take the people who don't want to participate out of the pool of names. It shouldn't really be that much of an issue. My opinion is that the people that express that they would not like to participate in this part of the challenge should still be eligible for the prizes because they are participating at a high level in this challenge anyway. Just some food for thought. Maybe there could be an exception granted to those who state a strong case to you. I don't think any of us who are going to adjust to the new layout would be butt hurt if one of them wrote an exceptional piece of poetry that you felt you needed to reward. Poets are often a breed who don't like rules, and this challenge had few. Maybe this new system should be voluntary. 😎

$1.57

mamadini (56) 7 years ago (edited)

I’m feeling what you are saying @prydefoltz.

@d-pend,
Once upon a time I would have loved this critique assignment (in my more academic days, when I was much more aligned to that/this mindset); however, it is pretty far from where I am these days. If there is a piece I need to focus (on a more mundane level) on for constructive critique that I'm actually not inspired by (for whatever reasons); well, that can be a big time investment as one is trying to find ways of communication without offense (and who the hell am I anyway… lol) , this is a concern for me as everything right now has cut my writing time to a short segment in my days and I’d rather focus on writing poetry and making the assorted comments as I have been all along.

Secondly, and perhaps more importantly; I am in much more of an introspective space when it comes to others work in the outer world, i.e. I just enjoy the work of others or not and try not to pick stuff apart (constructively as is being suggested), what meaning finds me is personal and I relish it that way these days. I did love critique in all my Lit classes and writing workshops and, of course, that was part of the objective before taking on heavy writing classes and such.

This seems like an aspect that should have been presented from the start as it’s a rather large structural change to this challenge that is now over half way in.

I am not throwing in the towel (as of yet) but this is a crossroad and I’ve not made a choice as I write this.

Respectfully, and in admiration,
N-

$0.95

d-pend (73) 7 years ago

Thank you for weighing in, Niish. I did mention in many of my updates that I reserved the right to change how the challenge operates, and it wouldn't have been feasible to institute something like this with a large number of poets.

I can empathize with what you're saying and I know would be content with the operation staying as it is. But I'm not really happy with the quality of interactions that I see between poets in this community. People tend to stay in their own "hollers" and peep out, to tiny degrees. I was envisioning something more substantial, more intense.

Now that we've all written and shared poetry nearly daily for 50 days, it should be almost second nature. In order for this to remain the challenge it was intended to be, I think people need to come more out of their comfort zones if they want to take their craft to the next level. My personality is usually to just allow people to do this at their own pace, but unfortunately my experience is that they do not do so without a significant nudge.

If you have some ideas about how I might be able to do this better, please don't hesitate to let me know, here or privately.

$0.58

6 votes

mamadini (56) 7 years ago

I think my response to @tygertyger pretty much sums up what I feel would be more judicious.

I’m not trying to change anyones mind, that is folly.

It has been a great pleasure and I thank you.

As I said I am grateful to have found a few more people in the world that inspire me and that is a Win.

Best of luck to everyone. <3

$0.26

tygertyger (65) 7 years ago (edited)

He did say at the beginning of the challenge that he might change the rules along the way . I know that this kind of structure might be a bit uncomfortable for a free being like you love, but communication between the participants seems to have become a bit insular. This challenge was born to strengthen the community, but also to inspire budding writers. How are they however supposed to evolve if they do not get feedback on how to grow? And is art not there to communicate and maybe put sparks in others? If we just throw our stuff in the wind and live under glass domes like the little prices rose we become like her self-indulgent I feel and we loose our grounding. And to be frank there will be stuff that might suck but they cannot break out of that if no one gives them the time of day, just something to ponder <3

$0.56

mamadini (56) 7 years ago

I am all for a weekly mention with a meaningful reason as to why. I am even all for a mandatory class day, those things seem fine and less structural... critique as mandatory is basically adding on anther challenge and frankly, I would not have entered had that been on the agenda. I am so all for community and that has been a great success for me so far in this as I've found kindred here in this challenge. ;)
This forced critique aspect is just not feeling great (imo).

$0.37

tygertyger (65) 7 years ago

Would you feel more comfortable in leaving just 2 comments on what the poem invoked in you he did offer both forms as option. and the reason he chose this over mandatory class is that some people cannot come to class as they are in different time zones or work at that time .

$0.42

mamadini (56) 7 years ago

I understand the time-zone thing and the challenges here. So many needs to meet. I do prefer that option for sure as that is where I dwell these days. I was wondering if we could do something in a private (Only people in the challenge) "backroom" where we interact on documents through written interactions of feedback and general feelings to pieces at our leisure over the week.. I don’t know. Ugh, it’s getting so complicated.

$0.37

3 votes

tygertyger (65) 7 years ago

if the open forum is the issue there is a goggle doc option maybe (what do you think @d-pend ) but I don't know if every one will understand how to use it and it could turn into total chaos. But the atmospheric feedback option is offered you don't need to do a guy LOL ;) let the idea germinate a bit ok? See how you feel about it then :)

$0.41

d-pend (73) 7 years ago

I'd prefer to do mandatory class as well @mamadini, but the problem there is time zones, and in some cases technology. I do feel the project is lacking something. It was intended to be more than a motley crue of people all doing their own thing, because that's kind of how poetry on Steemit was before. You definitely could be right that this is not the way to go about remedying it, but I'm just not sure how else to. :(

$0.42

mamadini (56) 7 years ago

I was wondering if we could do something in a private (Only people in the challenge) "backroom" where we interact on documents through written interactions of feedback and general feelings to pieces at our leisure over the week.. I don’t know. Ugh, it’s getting so complicated.

$0.36

prydefoltz (65) 7 years ago

Hi Daniel. I think I will continue on with the challenge of writing a poem a day, but I will be bowing out of the critique portion of the new rules. Through out the contest I have not limited myself to commenting and enjoying 3 poems a day and have supported much more than that. But I am loathe to critique fellow poets. I am happy to offer positivity and support but not critique. I entrust a poets development to the muses. I understand this may disqualify me from enjoying in the rewards, but I hope it won't keep me from taking part in the challenge as it was originally laid out. I hope you understand.

$0.77

d-pend (73) 7 years ago (edited)

Hi @prydefoltz, I don't think it will be necessary for you to bow out. Feedback is very personal, so I wouldn't expect you to offer anything that runs contrary to your inclinations. The expectation is just for it to be at least several sentences, going into greater detail than an ordinary comment. It need not "critique" anything so much as offer substantial insight and impressions. @geekorner's article was listed as reference for anyone not familiar with offering the gift of substantial feedback - don't let the term scare you :-) Critique in this context means analysis, not criticism.

$0.61

7 votes

prydefoltz (65) 7 years ago (edited)

I think I would prefer to continue on as I have been going, commenting on the posts that inspire me to comment upon. Poetry is so personal and insisting that people comment on work they might not have otherwise may have some unintended consequences. I have been doing this kind of thing for about six years and things can get hairy when poets take to this kind of thing. Plus I really don't want to pick from the work of others or even my own work. I just want to write and read what speaks to me. I'll continue to write and visit the other poets but no assignments for me. Sorry.

I understand your point of view. But the grounds for the contest have changed and I probably wouldn't have joined in if the I had been given such a specific assignment from the start. That doesn't mean I do not appreciate all the work you have done. I am seriously thankful for the opportunity you have given us all. Poetry on steemit has become stronger and so has our community. I'll still be supporting everyone and complete the challenge of 100 poems. Thank you for all your hard work and attention:):):)

$0.77

d-pend (73) 7 years ago (edited)

Thanks for your contribution to the project thus far and for leaving your feedback @prydefoltz. It's hard because I know many would be fine with the contest remaining the same, but I'm discontent with how it's going so far.

The intention was not only to challenge people to become more consistent with their craft but to build a community. While I've seen this happen to small degrees, I have not witnessed the deeper interaction necessary for the further personal growth of the individuals involved.

In my experience, poets (and artists in general) tend to rest on their laurels unless confronted with challenges that push them outside their comfort zone. It often includes interacting with people and energies that one would not otherwise. Of course I respect your decision. If you have a better idea on how to improve the quality (not only quantity) of interactions between poets, please let me know, here or privately!

$0.57

6 votes

prydefoltz (65) 7 years ago (edited)

Thank you, Daniel. Ultimately people are responsible for their own growth, no matter whether it be artistic or otherwise. But like will attract like; that is the way of the universe and so is making sure we all grow and learn.

I have found the challenge personally and artistically rewarding. So I will continue business as usual: writing a poem each day and visiting other poets. I never limited myself to 3 poems a day. Where some are concerned who perhaps have not supported the work of others very much, they will get back what they put in. That is also the way of the universe.

There will always be social loafers; and sometimes, they are not loafing at all but just have other demands the rest of us are not aware of.

It is your contest and I would say make the rules as you would have them. I would warn against policing others because that will be stressful and time-consuming for you. I want you to understand I am in no way upset by the change in rules. It's just not something I want to do. But I get it.

If you want my advice for the future. I would offer a reward once a week like you are going to do now. I would link the rewards to the value of the posts that are directly related to administering the contest and I would assign some roving comment up-voters. That is ... have some of the prize pool go to the comments and not just the poems. This would encourage people to comment more. But a certain amount of attrition should be expected. There are still lots of people persevering. I think you have fostered poetry beautifully.

$0.62

7 votes

sansoncarrasco (53) 7 years ago (edited)

I wrote an ample comment in the last update stating how this challenge have been taxing and rewarding at the same time.

I do appreciate your initiative and effort to promote poetry.

I don't like the one award per week per category change. I think this change takes some of the fun out of the contest.
I would like it if every poet was required to write a single poem each week so he/she can put a greater effort on it, proofreading, etc., but it would no longer be a 100 day challenge.

On the other part of the change, I will find it hard to fulfill this new requirements because I have a full time job and Steemit as my second income and I need to have time to write or produce other type of content, not only poetry.

This has been very demanding and taxing. I haven't skipped a single day, thought, because I'm prefer to save those skip days for days when it would be impossible for me to publish like, for example, if something happens to my Internet connection (I live in the third world) or I get sick or things get ugly at work and I have to stay late several days in a row. So laziness is not the reason I don't like this change. I think the challenge is demanding enough as it is... or was.

I used to write in my mother tongue, Spanish, and then do a handcrafted, fastidiously adapted and revised translation into English which I speak as a second language. The Spanish originals were mostly poems with rhyme and metric. I wanted my Spanish readers to enjoy the poems, and some of them were curated by Spanish-speaking curators and won the day and/or week in this (English poetry) challenge. But beginning at day 42 I had to completely drop writing in Spanish at all and began writing directly in English and free-verse, because I no longer have the time or energy required for such a humongous overload.
This also means my Spanish-speaking readers and curators no longer can read my challenge entries without using Google Translator which, as you know, may kill the spark of poetry from a text.

I understand that the interaction has not been as you expected and that that was your main motivation for creating this challenge: promoting poetry and the dynamic exchange of ideas between poets, but I don't know if I will be able to make it to the end.

I love poetry and that love for poetry is recorded in the Steemit blockchain, but I also have to earn a living and get some sleep.

I'll do my best.

$0.71

3 votes

d-pend (73) 7 years ago

Thank you for your input @sansoncarrasco. I've admired your contributions and was amazed at the work it must take to make English adaptions of your Spanish poetry daily. I understand what you're saying about not liking the prize shift. If I started a project like this again, I would not do so by myself. I'd have several people commit to helping me curate through the entire period. You know how it is, people get busy, sick, things come up, and they can't find the time to help any longer.

Because of the difficulty of the daily writing requirement, the unfortunate consequence is that on some days, the writing across the boards is lacking in quality and I have to assign a winner that has spelling issues, grammatical problems, etc. It's hard for me to do this with a good conscience because I don't want to just increase the quantity of poetry on Steemit, but help people become better poets.

I understand and honor you for taking the time while being employed. I think we could work something out where you only have to look at one poet in a week. It should take only a half hour to leave a well-thought-out response to one of their pieces. Does that seem feasible?

$0.40

2 votes

sansoncarrasco (53) 7 years ago (edited)

Thanks for analyzing carefully my long replay.

What you propose about one single analysis per week would make it easier to do. Just a bit. I'll try to do as everyone else but I'm glad there's some flexibility to compromise at the one-per week review.

The lack of incentives, not being able to produce my usual content, is something hard to overcome, though.

I'll play along to the extents of my capabilities.

$0.14

2 votes

firststeps (46) 7 years ago

I understand what I have to do and fully support the change. It will definitely push me out of my comfort zone but I feel I’m ready to embrace it. I look forward to honest critiques of my work.

Most of my poetry has been extremely personal and thus highly therapeutic for me. This is often the case with poetry, and can leave us feeling a bit vulnerable. I trust that all of us here understand that and realize critiques will focus on structure, grammar, word choice, and craft. They are in no way judging content or even intention.

Building community requires honesty and vulnerability.

$0.70

6 votes

marlyncabrera (70) 7 years ago (edited)

Polemic. Well, my opinion is that beyond rules of aesthetic nature, nothing you do to control poetry writing and critique—ever—seems natural.

I will play along, @d-pend, and see how this goes.

I promise that I will tell whenever I find myself uncomfortable, for the sake of honesty and my respect for you, guys. So far, I just can say I totally respect and understand all opinions expressed here. I particularly appreciate the clarity of @prydefoltz’s exposition, who is certainly providing wise warning.

I’m learning to cope with challenge here on Steemit, in general. This is actually soul therapy for me, so forgive me, friends, my moral laxity on these matters.

Besides, I understand that critique is personal and specific regarding purpose, and the purpose of this challenge, as I understand it, is two folded: writing poetry everyday with the benefit of probably winning and profiting from it, yes (and nothing is less poetic than the blockchain); but also promoting #steemitschoolpoetry, which means academic issues and some regulations would reach us at some point.

To sum up, I support the changes introduced in the challenge, and I promise to offer feedback regarding these changes when we're done, for I just can't tell right now.

I hope the fact that I’m tired, for it’s almost 1 a.m. here, has not affected my wits. Good night, beautiful people.

$0.70

3 votes

mamadini (56) 7 years ago (edited)

@d-pend, I covered my weekly obligations per the new rules (comments that were/are more substancial on my poets of the week and a weekly highlight). I apologize that this is so late (as is my daily poem also but I am just now home and have the internet to post -- this is how weekends go from here on out for me). I amdead-tired and am getting up in a few hours to start all over again, so please pardon any typos. :) :P

My highlighted poem of the week is from Stephen Martin : https://steemit.com/steemschool/@acousticsteveo/100-days-of-poetry-day-54-now-that-i-know

‘Now That I Know’ is a gem of repetition that rhythmically pulls the reader through a series of one sentence stanza groupings. There is a quality of transcendence from the experiential first stanza to the judgments of the second into that which is revealed through the process that leads to the last two lines. The ending thought is where the form is broken into a two line thesis with a line-break of declaration — that which is revealed through the revelation of the piece.

“Now that I know
That I know.”

I very much admire the flow of this piece and the meaning in which I derived from it. Now, I prefer not to deconstruct this into what I’ve extrapolated from this piece, my personal relationship with the poem is my own and I revel in the power of fine art to accomplish this. However, As with most art I find fascinating, there are many ways to read this piece. I can certainly see one finding a religious tone here, or a romantic overture also would not be hard to squeeze from the line stack — for me there is always certain prudence in bringing all things inward, as if this were a letter to one’s soul (free of religion though, or at least separate of doctrine).

Whatever story you find in this poem, I highly recommend reading it out loud so that you may feel the words, find the rhythm, your rhythm for them and relish in the beauty of this wonderful work.

$0.69

2 votes

https://steemit.com/steemitschoolpoetry/@acousticsteveo/100-days-of-poetry-day-55-deprogramming#@mamadini/re-acousticsteveo-100-days-of-poetry-day-55-deprogramming-20180501t225210659z

mamadini (56) 7 years ago

Here are the links to the pieces from Tyger and Steve:

https://steemit.com/steemitschoolpoetry/@tygertyger/totem-day-56-of-the-steemitschool-100-day-writing-challenge-by-d-pend#@mamadini/re-tygertyger-totem-day-56-of-the-steemitschool-100-day-writing-challenge-by-d-pend-20180501t223725657z

$0.00

mrbreeziewrites (58) 7 years ago

Thanks for the opportunity ones again @d-pend. The challenge has really grown me.

This is a nice idea for community sake and as mentioned, it'd be an avenue for us to learn more, see new dimensions to our works and help us grow more.

I, however, must point out that it might not be consistent as I might miss out some days. But, definitely, I appreciate this development and I'll gladly play along.

$0.53