RE: Beethoven is the Best Composer, Change my Mind
Looks like you kick-started some discussion. This was a great idea to launch a conversation. Thanks for the post!
I'm going to argue that Beethoven is not the best composer because there's no way to know who the best composer is. Because it's not measurable, we can't know who the best composer is, or if there even is one.
Granting your points (although I agree with @bengy & @classical-radio that "single handedly" is probably an overreach.) There are still areas that Beethoven did not dominate. Opera, especially, comes to mind. Also, Beethoven never composed a movie score. And, I'm not sure if he wrote any requiems? Although I only know what I've learned 2nd-hand through your lessons, here are some other examples:
- Bach & Mozart handed down the rules of counterpoint and voice leading. One could argue that Beethoven was standing on their shoulders, as well as his own teacher, Haydn's.
- Mendelssohn wrote fantastic compositions at a much younger age, as a teenager.
- Schubert was a far better song writer.
- Mozart was a far better opera writer
- Mozart had the best-selling CD of 2016.
- James Horner's Titanic Soundtrack was the best-selling classical music CD in the last 25 years, which covers much of the time when people have been able to buy music en masse.
- Bach and Schubert both composed massive numbers of compositions.
All of those, and others, could plausibly be claimed as the best composer. So could Beethoven. It all depends on the importance we place on the different factors. But, since there's no objective way to measure it, the claim that Beethoven is the single best composer is, IMO, not supported.
Thanks again for the post! Great way to launch a discussion.
Ha, I did forget about the lack opera! But you do make a good point, it is hard to quantify what makes the best composer. Beethoven was deficient in some areas of composition for sure.
I would also add that just because you like any one particular composer doesn't mean they don't have some off days! I recently did a Bach cantata that was eminently forgettable... And also I generally like playing Telemann, I never like all the movements in a suite or sonata.
It's hard to make every cantata memorable when you're writing a new one every week :)
Thanks for the input!
This is a point that I have often seen made. However, I don't think that because you learned something from someone else that necessarily means that your achievements are theirs. Haydn, Mozart, and Bach learned from someone else who learned from someone else. The cycle goes on forever. In order to be concrete, let's call Beethoven's achievements his own. But, fair point.
This is true, but these compositions did not have a huge cultural impact. Mendelssohn was a good composer, but he was not known to be a huge rule breaker like Beethoven. He innovated, but not on the level that other composers of his time innovated.
This may be true, but it is due to the fact that Beethoven did not prioritize songs like Schubert did. I will say that Beethoven has songs which are just as innovative and complex as Schubert's, but there is a reason why Schubert was called the king of song. However, there is also a reason why Beethoven was called the king of harmony by the same person. Both men were talented, but I again feel like Beethoven had a larger cultural impact.
Beethoven was a far better symphony writer. The reasoning is again priorities and focus. Mozart dedicated a lot of his time and effort to opera. Beethoven did the same with his symphonies. However, I will say Fidelio is the first opera with a female protagonist. Like that has anything to do with musical achievement.
That's because there are like 10 people who still actually buy CDs. Though I applaud the market based approach. I will say though that a lot more people know Beethoven's music than Mozart's. For example, here's a list of the 10 most famous pieces (that I just found and probably has no scientific backing). Beethoven is the only composer on the list with 2 pieces.
This music came out much more recently than Beethoven's. It was also featured in a major motion picture.
Beethoven had a descent amount. Probably a lot more than James Horner. I again will make the point that Beethoven's music had a larger cultural impact than Bach or Schubert's.
Thanks for the feedback!